GROUP W

Sent: Monday, November 30, 1998
Dear Sir,

I found your web-site with pictures of a concealed roulette computer very
interesting. I have read mentions of these trials on several occasions and
have been looking for more information about this interesting effort.

I have also been trying to find someone who can construct a concealed Black
Jack computer, and noticed that you have already done it! I was recently
offered to buy one of the old "George" computers that Ken Uston used, but
turned it down. I would think that something similar but smaller and
better than "George" could be constructed with todays technology. My idea
is to fit the entire computer, input and output in a pair of shoes which
should not look suspicious even if closely scrutinised. With your
experience, do you think this is possible and would you be willing to
assist in this task?

Yours faithfully
Albert


Sent: Sunday, March 07, 1999
Subject: Kin computer


Hello,
Can you give me any help locating software that plays like the Kin computer
for correct blackjack playing. I am aware that the Kin computer is considred
a cheating device. I want the program to analize faults of current blackjack
systems in the short run.
Thank You,
D. Lawrence


Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2001
Subject: Roulette wheel for sale ?!

Do you have It now. I like to buy it.

PS I play roulette from 1974 as The job, and I think, you guys are
little ...
I also was a dealer for 10 years. Did You know ball can be thrown with
"brake"- backward spin, rolled ahead or just made to glide. Each have
deceiving speed.
I never had a  loosing week.

Wheel-table. I do teach my friends to win.


Sent: Monday, September 21, 1998
Subject: how much for the wheel

wondering the cost of the wheel
benny

 


 


Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 1999
Subject: roulette calculator


Roulette Calculator: give me the price and where can I order one.
Please send me your address and phone number. thankyou.


Sent: Saturday, August 28, 1999
Subject: Roulette: Physical Prediction


Hi,

I saw your web page on physical prediction- very cool. I investigated exactly this technique a while back, though I went through a theoretical derivation of a prediction equation (and then fitted data to determine the parameters in the equation). I was focusing on a system that would not require concealed timing devices or electronics- this meant mental timing of the ball and wheel, and short-cut nomographs for calculating the predicted outcome. It also required two people to implement, because the timing and calculations were very demanding mentally (impossible to do everything yourself). The system worked, but needless to say, it was very difficult to play in the casino atmosphere.

Warren.


Sent: Sunday, October 24, 1999
Subject: what's error?


What is dependence between error of foot-timing the ball and error of the clock position in which the ball landed? I think small error in timing can give us big error in prediction of clock position in which the ball landed.
Michael.


From: Miljenko ***
Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2000
Subject: I'd like to have some more info about r.b.calculator
Aug.28, 2000.
Hello!


My name is Miljenko *** and I live in ***, Croatia. (Europe)
As a keen and passionate roulette player always in a search for a ways to beat a machine, my internet surfing brought me a few days ago, quite unexpectedly (that is to say, I put the words roulette systems into my search browser, and among a zillion other items, it listed I must admit, to my big surprise a term roulette betting calculator as well) to the US Patent & Trademark Office page, namely the one with description of Patent no.4,357,659, a roulette betting calculator, stating youself as an inventor of this, by my oppinion, uncomparable patent. The abstract told me enough to make me limitlesly currious about it, so I downloaded and printed out the description file, as well. Therefore, myself being a kind of person who prefers to do his best in contacting people whose works and ideas I am sincerelly interested in person, I decided to turn to you regarding mentioned.
Hoping that I would deserve some of your precious time in order to get some additional info details, as well as your kind help and advice, please allow me to mention a few thoughts considering game of roulette and why I see such a device as your betting calculator the only logical way to successfully compete and predict the roulette wheel outfall.
Since I started to play roulette practically, I ve been in constant search for a really new and refreshing, but above all effective ways to fight the roulette. However, altough some of the myriad of systems I ve tried so far had some internal, mostly statistical, logics built into them, what they proved to deliver sooner or later was just another disappointment, as they either didn t work at all or they worked far below my expectations mainly because they lacked a steadyness and reliability I was hoping to find. Looking today, from a time distance, on that trials in vain, (and, I believe, I could even say: with both eyes clear), I can face the reality by stating that this all was not an inch worse than expected, considering the game s rock steady statistical laws. Some say that it s better to use a bad system than no system at all ; I, from my side, after trying both the bad and fairly good ones, may state that even the last one wouldn t give you a occasional enough, not to mention permanent pleasure to beat the casino edge and be the overall winner.
I used to, and I think might say that I prefer, play a computer driven type of roulette, with an electronic bet imputs. (the wheel is standard-sized, closed with a glass cupola, and the ball is rotating opposite to wheel in fact, its look is just the same as ground one, the croupier-driven , only difference is that the ball is spinned internally from machine; this, by my oppinion and experience gives the ball more chance to computerly alter the speed randomly than with an classic one, thus giving the casino even bigger edge against sector players ).I think the reasons can be found in better personal comfort, more time to think and combine bets, and bigger level of privacy this kind of roulette offers to player. Finding out about the principles you were following when developing your patent, simplifiedly said that the time distance between occurences of two given numbers passing same point, if measured preciselly enough, can show us the approximate position of outfall, I referred to some of my tests regarding similar ideas. In fact, when considering the idea that roulette can be beaten only and exclusively by measuring elapsed time I was lead equaly by a kind of intuition and a logics, which tells us to look at the wheel as a purely phisycal phenomena, thus having its own laws of ball speed, wheel speed and their relations (and not just tool to randomly show the numbers, which follow the probability laws). However, not having available a proper means to take advantage of such notion, I couldn t use it to advance my game methods seriously; so it remained just the idea.
Well, the idea just woke up into new life, making me notice what I have missed all the time the electronic measuring tool to predict the outfall of numbers. By reading your patent description, I ve noticed that it could be programmed to indicate the group of several preferable numbers; I think it is particularly usefull when playing an europian-type, one-zero roulette (which is the only type available here, so I use to play that type exclusevely), because as you know, it offers an extra possibility to bet on one of three different sectors (big series, small series, orphans) so if, for example, no. 26 which is in middle of (18 numbers) big series, we can just, with a great confidence, bet on big series to appear. If the preffered number is, say, 14, we could just chose an orphans and a few numbers on both sides, and so on
In fact, my previous paragraph is related with my following question I d like to address to you: is there a europen-wheel version of your roulette betting calculator available?
Also, please let me ask you a few question I d be proud and grateful to receive first-hand answers from you, as myself being immensely attracted, not to say fascinated, to the device you ve developed and the ideas behind it. Namely, what is the best way to find out about the buying possibility and price of roulette betting calculator? Is the device tested practically and what were the results? Also, is there any additional presentation, picture e.t.c. available?
Finally, let me say once again that I, as a roulette player, am heartily appreciating your efforts, and sincerelly hoping to hear from you soon with your valuable help and advices.

Wishing you many success and luck in your current and future work,

Sincerelly yours:
Miljenko xxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx xx
xxxxxxxx, Croatia


Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2000
Subject: RE: I'd like to have some more info about r.b.calculator
Importance: High


Dear Miljenko

Thank you for your very nice letter. I am not the inventor of the betting calculator (patent). But am the inventor of the BlackJack computer and of I am the co-inventor of the roulette predicting computer, both described on my web pages. http://nowscape.com/blk/roul/image-1.htm

(My friend, with whom I developed the roulette machine thinks that the patented betting calculator will not work. I say this only as a matter of information to you).

Our roulette predicting computer did not work, and we gave up the project in about 1985. I believe we lacked precision timing, mainly.

By coincidence with your letter, I was just working yesterday, until late in the evening, on re-analyzing the roulette data form 15 years ago. I am in the process of using neural nets to see if there is predictability in that manner. I have downloaded some demo neural net programs from download.com and am just now familiarizing myself in their operation.

Your mention of the computer driven type of roulette is interesting -- I have never heard of this. It just also happens that I have become interested in predicting the outcome of computerized gambling (such as on the internet). Where are these machines located? Where do you play? I assume gambling is legal in Croatia -- is it illegal to use computers there?

--  NOWSCAPE


Sent: Saturday, September 02, 2000
Subject: Roulette speed prediction and use of devices


Rijeka, Sept 2, 2000

Hello   NOWSCAPE!


Thank you very much for your reply to my e-mail regarding roulette betting calculator. The fact is, I wrote the original letter to mr.Nathans, whose name is stated at American Bureau of Patents as the inventor of mentioned device (by the way, he didn t reply yet). However, as I was browsing the net I saw some more related links, so I sent the same letter (only slightly modified) to your address as well.
Well, talking about coincidences, another one- which cries to mention it! - happened yesterday, just a few hours before I saw your e-mail. Talking with one of my acquintances (you bet another roulette freak!), I came to mention a calculator which description I saw on net; moving the speech in the same direction, he told me about his friend who seemed pretty familiar with an idea of connecting two players wirelesly (or at least he presented it the way that you have an impression he knows what his friend is talking about). To simplify, the concept is following: while one person sits and plays at the casino, another one is situated in a vehicle nearby, equipped with a complete computer (thanks to today s tehnology, a single pc-notebook should be sufficient) and a belonging special program which allows him to analyse the wheel s outfall and to give a prediction according to results. Then, he sends the predicted number/sector over tiny wireless receiver well hiden by the player. The whole thing requires a wirelless transceiver, a tiny camera recording the wheel s spins and of course, a perfect co-ordination.
Having read your letter, the first thing which came to my mind was that coincidences, which begun with your case, tend to continue; I was presented by your site with an images and rough description of a device similar to what I was talking about just a while ago. Even more, yours (and your friend s) efforts brought the idea into life a fully fifteen years ago, so if I could dare to conclude, if such an equipment was possible to be developed then, today s miniaturisationing technology should make it even more refined making virtually impossible to even raise suspicion by casino sharks and even more, make an use of precise predicting programs possible (which is, of course, a main key to success).
I don t know about functionality and effectiveness of a roulette betting calculator , but nevertheless I think that its approach (the way I understood it from a full description text available at
http://164.195.100.11/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=/netahtml/srchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1='4357659'.WKU.&OS=PN/4357659&RS=PN/4357659 )
 corresponds nicely with a practice of roulette wheel rotation and with the physical facts about it. I mean, the way I consider roulette play over theory and practice (how can you feel when, for example you decide to bet a big money on first and second column after third column shows itself six times, and then it comes the seventh as well? and things like that happened to me!), trying to predict the outfall in roulette by basing your calculation on ball s and wheel s speed is most probably THE ONLY WAY to beat the machines. The logics is following: if we take the very moment of ball s approaching the same point (I mean, when the ball meets the same number, for example zero to simple test we can use a 1/100 sec. stop-watch) by recording its starting time and we take the moment of the next approach and record it again, we already know a valuable data about relative speed of ball. When we also know the previous winning number and ball s speed, the only more thing we need is a precise device able to calculate the outfall by entering that datas; it may be even filled up with a kind of database with start number, the measured speed and the winning number as arguments Eventually, distractions like ball s hitting one of diamonds at circles cannot significally ruin the calculation.
As we all know, croupiers (especially the highly skilled ones) are able to alter the velocity of ball s spin often (to hide the trace , so to speak). The computerly driven and controlled wheel I m playing against, by the unofficial information I get, is able to change the ignition speed of ball in four different speeds (by the way, the maker is firm named Alphastreet from Slovenia our neighboring country I haven t checked yet, but perhaps their site is available somewhere on the net). This could be truth, and if it is, the main question how they use to switch it from turn to turn ; I think that the most logical answer seams to be: at random.
Shortly, what we need to catch that rabbit is to measure its speed first By the efforts and imaginative ideas of people like you, that day don t seem to be far away any more!
So, in the end, let me say that I m sincerely interested in your re-works of the roulette predicting equipment and I wish you to keep up the good work. And the will and determination as well (and I can see you ve got it in large amounts!), for the sake of us thousands of gratefull players out there
Hope to hear from you again about news of your re-developing, advices, help or anything I would help if I could anyhow, too.

Best regards


P.S. I dindn t try it yet, but I doubt that they d allow me the use of anything more than a simple pocket calculator when playing (on some places probably not even that) the point about r.b.calculator developed by mr. Nathans is that it could be hidden in pocket and be programmed to make a silent call of sort, like sector one one bump, sector two two bumps etc. By the way, please inform me if your friend knows any further detail about r.b.c.; I say it because you ve mentioned that it probably won t work. Did he try it or does he know about it from other who tried it?
And, sorry if was too brief I m not too speechy, but I like to write.


Hello again, Miljenko

My friend with whom I developed the roulette machine shown on the web page thinks it's NOT possible to predict the outcome by using the method by which a point, say, "0" is timed against the motion of the ball. (I call this the "occultation method", after similarities with making planetary observations) That's why, in our machine we timed the ball against an outside reference point, and we separately timed the rotor against the same point. By the way, I disagree with my friend, and I think the occultation method would work.

If one has enough data (timings), then I don't think that the launch ball's speed and the rotor's speed matter. Given enough time, a fast launch speed will decay into a slower speed, and than the speed decay to the same as that from an initially slow launch speed, at some point. The only difference would be the "English" of the ball, which seems would 'wear off' differently. What effect this English has, is unknown to us.

One factor which we ignored was atmospheric pressure, and we believe now that we should have factored it into our calculations.

I am just now staring to re-analyze our data using neural net software. I learned about this at the university 20 years ago, but I have no experience. I downloaded 3 or 4 such programs from downlaod.com, but find them difficult to use, I need some more practice.

Thanks for writing, and please stay in touch.

--  NOWSCAPE


Sent: Friday, July 18
Subject: roulette-1000's of recorded spins

i would appreciate if you could send me some 1000's of actual recorded
spins of a single zero wheel. i want to test an idea of betting say
black after 2 or 3 reds in a row have just gone. thankyou for your time.
i can give more explaination if you want.


Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001
Subject: vincent tan data?

Doh! I was very excited by your roulette web site, but couldn't click through to Vincent Tan's web page. Apparently it has been cancelled since it doesn't even exist at the University of Sydney any more.

Do you also have the roulette data from him in "modern" form?

Thanks,
Craig


Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2001
Subject: Roulette wheel for sale ?!

Do you have It now. I like to buy it.

PS I play roulette from 1974 as The job, and I think, you guys are
little ...
I also was a dealer for 10 years. Did You know ball can be thrown with
"brake"- backward spin, rolled ahead or just made to glide. Each have
deceiving speed.
I never haed loosing week.

Wheel-table. I do teach my friends to win.


Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2001
Subject: Roulette wheel for sale ?!

Do you have It now. I like to buy it.

PS I play roulette from 1974 as The job, and I think, you guys are
little ...
I also was a dealer for 10 years. Did You know ball can be thrown with
"brake"- backward spin, rolled ahead or just made to glide. Each have
deceiving speed.
I never haed loosing week.

Wheel-table. I do teach my friends to win.


Sent: Saturday, July 21, 2001

Dear Sir

My name is Frank and I am from Europe.

I am very much interested in roulette strategies based on predicting
where the ball will fall down with or without of electronic devices and
micro computers.

May I ask you to tell me some more about your approach.
I have some ideas, also know some people here in Europe who
worked on this approach one also updated your idea.

I am more interested in wearable micro computers. Do you
know anyone who has or can make these small computers?

Very important are also transmitors.

In next e-mail I will tell you about one special roulette table without
any croupier and which is ideal for your approach.

I thank you and I am looking forward to hear from you soon.

Best regards
Frank


I don't rally have much to add to what I've posted on the net. If you have some specific questions, I will try to give you an answer. I think that any of the hand-held computers available these days would work well for this project. It's the software and design, that present the difficulty :)


Dear Sir

Thank you very much for your e-mail.

The main reason why I am interested in these devices is that I found
one special roulette table which offers ideal conditions for some hidden
things. Also the law is not so tough here. Please, see below what I found.

I found "electronic-authomatic" roulette table with single zero
wheel. 8 players can sit around it and each one has an electronic roulette
table layout and with the finger you choose the bet(s) you would like to
play on next spin. You can bet
exactly all bets you can play on normal roulette table and cover as many
numbers as you want (no need to play on every spin). The best is that you
can sit at table and there is no croupier who could affect on your play, and
you do not have other people behind you who could watch how you play.

And now the best part: in the center of square table is a real single zero
wheel which rotates around and air compressor catapults a real small
roulette ball (instead of croupier) around the wheel in 1 minute intervals.
So all players (up to 8) are depended from the same single spin.

Some more details about the wheel:
- Diameter is about 90 to 100 cm (1 meter) - it looks similar as real roulette wheel.
- the ball is catapulted only counter-clockwise in every spin.
AND the wheel is rotated only clockwise every time.
- after the ball drops into the slot (number), then in next 10 secunds the
wheel stop to rotate. Then the wheel uprear for 3 cm - enough that the
ball can drop under the wheel and come again to the position for
catapulting.
Everything is authomatical!!!
- The ball bounces and jumps around (because of frets and 8
diamonds)-exactly the same as on the real roulette table!!!
(It is a real roulette table - difference is only that compressor catapults the ball.
- Catapulting is always from the same place.


What do you think about this table?

Do you think that your approach could be exploited for this table too?

You mentioned some modern hand computers like are Palm Pilot or
Psion. The question is if maybe you have a computer program for
this kind of computers?


I thank you and I am looking forward to hear from you soon.

Best regards
Frank


Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2001
Subject: ROULETTE-FROM FRANCE


HELLO
I LIVE IN FRANCE I TRY TO PLAY ROULETTE PROFESSIONALLY BUT I THINK THAT THE BEST WAY TO BEAT THE WHEEL IS TO PLAY WITH A COMPUTER. THE PHOTO ON YOUR SITE ARE OLD DO YOU HAVE NEW STUFF AT WITCH PRICE,
BEST REGARD

JEAN Xxxxxxx Xxxxx
MY ADDRESS
06200 NICE FRANCE
TEL/XXXXXXXXXX


Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2001
Subject: roulette wheel


we do charity work and are looking for a roulette wheel - how much?
bernie


Sent: Thursday, June 20, 2002 11:23 AM
Subject: Roulette Wheel

Hello,
I was on the internet looking for some information on roulette prediction
and found your web site. I am a student in Electrical Engineering in the
state of Michigan. A couple of classmates and myself are thinking about
doing something similar to this as a senior project. THIS IS STRICTLY FOR
RESEARCH PURPOSES. I do know a little about the game and how it is played.

I understand you have a wheel for sale. How much is it and what size is it?
Before we decide if the project is complete able, we need to know the
cost.

We are all Electrical Engineering students with a limited Physics back
ground. Would you be willing to give us some ideas on what is needed to
write the code? We can figure out the hardware and test equipment, but do
not know what kind of equations are used for the software development.

I noticed you have have a picture of some of the code on the site, was it
written in Basic? We are planning to use a C-Complier for our software.

Please, let me know about the wheel so I can get back with my classmates.

Regards,


The kind of equations that are used for the software development, depend, of course, on how you want to tackle this project -- on what principles should the thing work? At this stage of the game, you should already have a good idea of what you want to do. Nobody will feed you ideas, so that all you people have to so is stuff you already know how to do! You said this is a research project. Do research. Think about how one would know where and when the ball will touch down in future. Think about how to tell the computer where the ball is at present. Think about how to predict which number will be at the place where the ball will when it must leave its orbit.


Hi,

I am trying to work out how to use this theory in predicting the numbers which will be generated on a roulette wheel in a gaming machine. I have noted that generally 13 numbers out of 37 do not appear in a 39 spin cycle. I am trying to work out how to reliably predict 2 - 3 numbers that will be generated in about 5 - 6 spin cycles.

Could you point me in right direction. I am sure that somebody has already carried out this work.

regards

Tony Dragovic


About Blackjack

      Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:08:55 +0100
      From: Ana Shorter <ana.shorter @ zkktv.com>
      Subject: Re: Documentary series on gambling

      Hello,
      I am a researcher working for ZKK, a London based documentary company.
      We are making a documentary series about gambling and I am looking into
      a case involving a roulette prediction computer hidden in a shoe. The
      case took place in 2001 in Australia and involved a Hungarian tourist at Star City.

      I hope I might be able to talk to you about the computers shown on your
      site / http://nowscape.com/blk/roul/index.html , /you have one with a
      switching device hidden in a shoe.

      If you are willing to talk with me, could you give me a call - or tell
      me a number I could reach you on I would appreciate it.

      Kind regards,
      Ana Shorter
      Researcher
      ZKK
      +44 207 482 5885
____________________________________________________________

   Hello Ana,

   I can be reached at [Telephone number removed] (US) re roulette and blackjack.  Looking
   forward to discussing the project.

   Cheers,
   Richard
____________________________________________________________

"Ana Shorter" <ana.shorter @ zkktv.com> wrote:

Dear Richard,
Sorry I did not get a chance to call you back on Friday. Hope we can talk next week.
I was just wondering ? while looking at your site ? are your partners based in the US too?
Regards, Ana